V 8 JAVELIN FOR SALE

[george garside]

absolutely no complaints! This is a rebodied Jowett in keeping with the ancient tradition of special building that lasted well into the sixties and arguably developed into todays kit car scene. If some enterprising individual started making simple chassis , maybe tubular or perhaps simple ladder frames on lines of the CD/R4 to take javelin running gear & mechanicla bits there would be scope for a few Javelin specials ( ?Javelin -Jupiters ) to resurect the remains of Javs that are 'beyond restoration' Those who favour two pots could use ssme chassis with tuned CC engines to produce a sort of CD special on the lines of 'the tram' ( first CD prototype) whcih used , initialy at least, a CC engine.

george

[Greg Jackson]

VERY WELL SAID

[Chris Spencer]

Raising the profile of the marque is essential and we need to attract young blood

Really - but that would mean appealing to the younger generation, making global use of the Internet, computers and all that !!! - Good idea but try convincing the other half of the current membership.

Yes, sharp intake of breath and all that - but it really is time that the club woke up to the notion of membership recruitment rather than just hoping that membership will just occur by default!

[Forumadmin]

Perhaps we should start a new 'concours' section for modern specials! Thus embracing the idea fully. Since we only had one 'special' at Gaydon, perhaps we combine period and new specials.
Then again sorting out 'originality' from 'acceptable replacement' from 'alteration or customization' is going to be a challenge for the judges! The flag system or 'People's award' is my vote for the way to do it.

Combining something new with something old in an aesthetically pleasing and 'engineeringly' pleasing way is an art.

[george garside]

somehow 'originality and 'specials' seems like a contradiction, irrespective of whether a 'special' was constructed fifty or sixty years ago or last week. Ass far as a concours classs for specials my initial thoughts are

- date of construction irrelevant

- If based on pre war or bradford must use jowett engine (but not necessarily the original type eg a Braaadford speial could have a 10/4 engine. Also JOwett chassis ( but could be modified) and Jowett running gear

- Jupiter specials - same as above

- Javelin specials as above but could use a specially constructed chassis with Jowett engine & running gear

- bodywork - only criteria being that it is broadly in keeping wth Jowett era & in the spirit of what a special builder of the Jowett era may have constructed.

on this basis a Bradford trials car or a aJupiter single seater raaaaacing car on a narrowed Jupiter chassis would be eligible as would a whole range of open bodies replacing collapsed saloons.

george

[aj4cks]

Started by American youth in the late forties and early 50s to customise old cars it is now a well established practice across the western world. Changing and modifying an old car can be both challenging and creative. It does not threaten a marque like Jowett and it does draw attention. The response to the first post on this topic illustrates that. I would love to see a Jowett hotrod in the skin alongside cars at a JCC national.
I agree with the view that we need to attract new members. We have an ageing membership. Unless things improve, in the next decade or less. we will have lots of Jowetts looking for new owners. The knowledge and experience gained by current members could be lost.
Lets agree to disagree as the argument to customise or not will always have a split view. V8 though! must go like, 'Shit off a shovel'

[Jack]

Raising the profile of the marque is essential and we need to attract young blood

Really - but that would mean appealing to the younger generation, making global use of the Internet, computers and all that !!! - Good idea but try convincing the other half of the current membership.

Yes, sharp intake of breath and all that - but it really is time that the club woke up to the notion of membership recruitment rather than just hoping that membership will just occur by default!

One thing at a time, Chris. We don't want to change the world in an afternoon. A weekend should do it

Membership will occur by default, however who do we expect our new members to be - only this week I had a call from a prospective member, a septagenarian looking for a retirement project. I just wonder if many of the current members realise that if (as we pretty much all expect to happen) an increasing number of cars are up for sale by owners and their families because they can no longer drive due to age, and a lack of new, younger members, the price of Jowetts will fall - there will be more sellers than buyers. That will result in more and more projects like this, where young people see a car that is fairly easily modified and suits the hotrod look, that they can buy for a few hundred pounds.

If I was very selfish I could take a personal view that declining new members suits me. All the cars I've seen at the rallies, but couldn't afford due to the cost, by the time I am 50 I'll be able to buy a little collection of Jowetts for only a few thousand pounds, and have my pick of cars as they come on to the market. I wonder if we'll be the only people left who will have the skills to work on them. Scary thought, but perhaps a nice profitable business for my retirement.

As a friend said to me last night (on an unrelated matter) - diversify, evolve, or die. Those are the rules of evolution. And of business, as it happens. Taking a very long term view, those are the only choices, no matter how good it might be right now. We might not need to diversify or evolve for 20 years. But eventually we, as an organisation, have to change.

Jack.

[Jack]

Perhaps we should start a new 'concours' section for modern specials! Thus embracing the idea fully. Since we only had one 'special' at Gaydon, perhaps we combine period and new specials.
Then again sorting out 'originality' from 'acceptable replacement' from 'alteration or customization' is going to be a challenge for the judges! The flag system or 'People's award' is my vote for the way to do it.

Combining something new with something old in an aesthetically pleasing and 'engineeringly' pleasing way is an art.

I agree - the People's Award does exactly that. The flag system was good, because it was visible, and the owner of any car with a flag knew that at least one person on the field thought their car was the best. I voted for a car that couldn't win a concours competition, that was interesting, highly modified, and very well presented at the Wakefield rally. It wasn't a hotrod or anything like it, it was made to look like a boat at the back end. But it was the most interesting car on the field to me - but then I am not exactly a massive fan of concours originality, it doesn't really matter to me.

If we wanted to create a hotrod division within the club, we could have a rolling road set up to see what bhp they were kicking out, 0-60 times, and more. In fact, that's not a bad idea for a rally some time, even without the hotrods - see how many horses are left under the bonnet of your Jowett - plenty of good firms with mobile rolling roads out there for the next rally. I wonder how much they charge...

Jack.

[Forumadmin]

Rolling road is quickest way to blow up a good everyday engine! Do it with Ford engines but not Jowett ones! Mind you we could have a tuning session which started with a rolling road and did a before and after. Charge £10 per horse-power gained and donate to club.
Any timed event is fraught with regulations. But holding driving or manoeverability tests can be done without much effort.
We used to hold driving tests every year at JAW. So perhaps in 2014 around Brooklands?

[Chris Spencer]

Well trust Keith to let the cat out of the bag with the location of the 2014 rally - I was trying to keep a lid on it until the negotiations were complete - well that's what you get with topic like this - Rodded Jav for sale - through to membership actions - Jack's retirement plans (before he reaches 30) and where we are planning to the rally in 2014 !!!

[aj4cks]

Now this truly is a bridge too far if the Jupiter chassis used to build this was from a complete car that was deliberately dismantled. What if a Jupiter Chassis had been found as the only surviving part and the custom car was designed and built onto it?

[Keith Andrews]

If you really want to see REAL hot rods, check out Aussie/NZ and the USA
Not 99% these eurpean wantta be so called 'rods....thu I have to admit the javelin does have great lines for rodding
And So does the Bradford...
Chop and chanel 1 1/2" out of the roof and out of the body widened about 10 or 12" to make the lowered stance look correct.
Drop on a model A chassis, GM Holden HT or HQ front subframe steering and suspension...or even a xjs ...go for a xjs rear end and suspension .. SB 383 or a more modern Ls1 with a 4 speed 700r trans behind it...
You have a 'rod that drives and rides like a jag, then pulls nps a 12 or low 13 sec 1/4 mile.
Add AC electric windows, and all the modern addons.
Ave age of a rodder in NZ or Aussie....a young Rodder generally in their 40s, most members now in their 50s thru 60s.
Both NZ and Aussie have more classic muscle cars, rods per head of population than even the US or the States.

Today we can buy new fibre glass shells for 3 window coupes, 'A' buckets, pops and a lot more, off the floor full ready made chassis, suspension without even touching or touching tradtional steel.
In NZ our biggest car shows, swap meets often coving many acres are run in partnership with both Hot Rod Clubs and Vintage/classic clubs....many have a foot in both areas today.

Hot Rodding is NOT to be confused or even has any association with boy racers, ricers and jappas.
Ecept for the Annaul Rodder /jappa competion weekend at the drag strip.

The pic above...The Bucket in the background IS a Hot Rod. ...the concept thing in the forground is not.

[David Kemp]

Folks, Most classic cars, whether Jowetts or Cadillacs, are owned by fifty year old men. They buy them because in their youth they saw, and desired a car they could not afford.
I saw my first Javelin as a small boy as a passenger in my Dads Bradford, that image has stuck for 40 years! I did not know that funny looking car was related to Dads Bradford, until a I became a car crazy teenager.
The BEST recruitment tool & cheapest for the club , is for members to DRIVE their Jowetts & catch the imagination of youth.
I have lived in Brisbane now for seven years & only know of one daily driven Javelin. & given I have seen NO ,Hillmans, Austins, Morris, Ford, Vauxhall's, Singers, Pontiacs of this era, it doesn't give clubs for these makes any better chance of recruitment. Lets beat these other clubs & get our Jowetts out of storage every week & show the flag. As for the hot rod Javelin , if it stirs one person to get a Jowett good on it.

[Forumadmin]

I wholeheartedly agree! I always encourage youngsters as young as three to sit in the driver's seat and play with the steering wheel. With older ones tell them something about the car and show them the engine, a bit older and let them help you do something on the car. Yes there is risk to your paintwork; but it involves them and gives them memories and desires. They come back for more and bring their friends. At shows, I also take kids and older people for a drive as most will not have experienced anything like it. I am so surprised by the lack of exposure and hands on experience of our new generation of TV and computer junkies. But there are still many that want something different.

The plan to let MG owners drive a Jowett at the JCC Weekend in Gaydon did not materialise. But a good idea!

[p.p.]

when the sun is out "Rhowina" me javelin is on the road, for work and fun also long drive's and short stint's.... i just love it

peter