Spanish Rally

[Keith Clements]

Moises Escola is currently looking at the possibility of a Jowett rally in Spain in September 2021.
This is the very early planning stage but thought I would gauge interest and preferences.

When ? After Goodwood Revival so that non-Europeans have another reason to come, but could be any other time, just that ferries are cheaper than in July/ August.

Where ? In the north of Spain and possibly Portugal depending on what distance you are prepared to travel. So let us know!

Route? Possibly this one. which avoids highways, has an easy option to shorten, is about 950 miles /1500 km. Moises would love us to also go to Madrid but that might be too far. Let us know if you would want to extend.

Options? Meet in Santander whether coming by ferry from Plymouth or Portsmouth/ Bilbao or travelling through France.

Duration? Around 14 days but could be a week or longer to possibly fit in with ferry schedule.

Distance travelling per day? Try to keep below 80 miles per day. This might be too far for pre-war cars which we would love to have along, so let us know.

Accommodation? We will try to suggest accommodation for each night halt and try to arrange discounts but this will depend on numbers. So the earlier you signal your intention to come the better.

Things to do? Try to find a couple of interesting things to do each day. So have a look at the route and see if there is anything which you think would be of interest to you or other Jowetteers.

There is some stunning scenery , fantastic history, delicious food and great wine in the area so start planning!

[Keith Clements]

https://www.thewholeworldisaplayground. ... ighlights/
https://www.caminos.co.uk/northern-spai ... o-santiago
https://www.responsibletravel.com/holid ... ve-holiday
https://www.theguardian.com/travel/2018 ... na-galicia
https://www.i-escape.com/blog/road-trip ... ern-spain/
https://mowgli-adventures.com/perfect-n ... itinerary/
https://lazytrips.com/trip/ultimate-nor ... -road-trip

and finally
https://winetourismspain.com/blog/12-hi ... ern-spain/

[Chris Spencer]

This is all fine for those that have time to commit 14 + days to a rally - the vast majority of don't have that luxury of time - surely a better idea would be for a shorter duration rally in a more accessible & commutable European location that would have a far greater appeal to all members i.e. France

[Keith Clements]

We have had many ( at least 5) Jowett rallies to France plus you can always go to Le Mans Classic or Angouleme, so something different. The ferry makes Northern Spain just as accessible, if not more, than Denmark or Switzerland. Chris, for you it is 51 miles to the start of the rally. If you want a shorter event then that could be accommodated but the area is so spectacular it would be a shame not to extend and make the rally into a holiday.

[Chris Spencer]

Has already stated we don't all have the luxury of time to commit to a 14 + day rally - and at 1500km / 950 mile duration you disregard virtually every pre war / vintage & Bradford Jowett owner / member - You probably have held several rallies in France previously but certainly not for the last 12 years - finally if we are going to organise overseas rallies it needs to be something that attracts has many members cars has possible not just a handful

[p.p.]

Rhowina, Ruth, me and dogy "Gira" would like to have a holiday in spain and portugal..... every year a action .... grantham, danmark, rally in england, and spain ..... wowwww just great...
peter

[Keith Clements]

We are aiming to include Bradford and Pre-war cars into the event. Their owners will need to say with what daily mileage they are comfortable, then we can plan accordingly. The notion that such cars cannot go long distances is false, since I have been with Brian Hehir who has 14 times traversed the 3500 miles across Australia to go to a Jowett Rally in his Bradford and with Bill and Sandra Purves who regularly ventured from Scotland to the far reaches of England in their Bradford. Pre-war cars too have ventured many miles across France.

This will not be a prescriptive rally where there is a lot of organisation around every day like on the Swiss, Dutch or Danish rallies. Maybe we can uncover interesting things that might need a group booking, but for now let us see what is on offer in the area as a tourist or traveller. When I say 'we' and 'us' I mean everyone who would like to come. The earlier you put forward a suggestion, the more likelihood that it can be incorporated into the tour.

The intention is to get a group of Jowett travellers together who will gain some confidence to tour by having other Jowett travellers around them. Of course, we will also have social interaction, we will have fun and we will see and do some great things.

Moises has said he will go up to the region shortly and bring back some ideas.

[Srenner]

I can understand the position that not everyone has the luxury of nearly unlimited time for touring or the desire to spend 10 hours a day in the car. Perhaps there is a way to structure the tour such that blocks of the proposed trip could be done inside the entire trip. Perhaps the standard format of "opening meet, travel/activities, closing dinner" could be modified to accommodate those who have fewer days available.

[Chris Spencer]

Keith - I don't think for one minute that you can base your assumptions on pre war / Bradford owners following on from the examples set by less than a handful of club 'Mavericks' who thought nothing of covering such distances in slow & elderly Jowett's - fact is that that owners of these type of vehicles will not want to cover the type of distances that you have in mind - nor will you want to travel at the speeds that the owners of pre war / Bradford's are restricted to. Secondly 14 days is not 14 days has you plan - has most owners will have to travel some distance to the ferry terminal and the minimum sailing time is then a further 24 hours hence someone traveling form the North may well have a 3 day trip just to get to Spain - add the 3 days return then to your 14 days = 20 days ! Thirdly cheapest economy ferry crossing is over £300 likely to be knocking the door of £400 in 2021 - add a trailer and the price virtually doubles then add between 14 - 20 days accommodation & sustenance costs - Nothing wrong with anyone proposing a international rally but it needs to be based upon sensible distances that can be covered by all Jowetts at sensible speeds, over a sensible time period that accommodates all members either employed or retired and finally it requires structuring on a sensible affordable budget in order for it to attract the maximum number of members & their Jowett's to attend - personally I don't see any of these points in your current proposal.

[Forumadmin]

The contingent from Cheshire who travelled to the Swiss rally drove to Hull where they took a ferry to Holland. They then drove to Dusseldorf to catch the car transporter train to Innsbruck then drove over the mountains to the start of the rally. I think their cost , time and effort was more than it would have been to go to the start of this Spanish rally where they only have to drive to Portsmouth.

[Chris Spencer]

Keith - You are completely missing the point here - to add 6 days of arrival & return journeys to a 14 day rally is simply expecting too much from the members - has already stated that would equate to a 20 days duration and you will be lucky if a handful of members that could commit to this timeframe - if you wish to promote an international rally then it needs to be done has already stated on a sensible & proven basis - so why not utilise the formula that has always worked for the club - promote a rally over an extended weekend based within one area - this will appeal to a far broader spectrum of members, their cars & the timeframe and should attract a reasonable attendance - if before or after the rally you and few others want to extend your stay in the country and go on a extended tour over many hundreds of miles then that is fine but don't expect to promote a 14 day tour has a club rally because at best its only going to be a few cars / members that can do it.

[Forumadmin]

Please read the heading 'duration' where I said it could be a week and the route is not planned so could be shorter. The idea was that many Jowett people would like to do a tour in a Jowett. This is an area we have not visited although we have had a Spanish member for well over 40 years.
The Swiss rally was 4 full days with say the maximum 3 days travelling each way ( even for the Danish, Finnish???? and German members) the British are lucky in that they have the ferry).
The Spanish rally could be the same. But I propose that those wishing to can extend by doing the tour either before or after such a 4 day event.
Currently we are gathering expressions of interest and can then work on how to please everybody.

[Chris Spencer]

Keith - I am not here to do constant battle with you - my points are if that you are to propose a rally or gathering of any kind in the clubs name it needs to appeal to the widest possible spectrum of the membership hence attracting sufficient numbers of both members & their cars - your opening proposal / gambit (call it what you will) was a 14 day - 950 mile trip at which point 97% of the membership reading it lost interest has the proposal does not appeal to them - you now back track and state that it could be a 4 day event based in one area - add the duration / extent of travel to this either side of the rally and it becomes viable for members to attend - has already stated if you and few other members wish to extend a tour either before or after the rally - then that is fine - your other points and no disrespect to any member are irrelevant has to how long they have been a member in whatever country. Lets stick to the facts that are proven of delivering a successful rally regardless of location but you must factor in the traveling duration either side of the rally and whilst our members enjoy putting their Jowett's to good use they don't want to be living / driving the cars every hour of the day. Finally I don't mind debating this topic openly and within the forum - other members maybe uncomfortable with it but unless debated openly it will not get resolved - we need to compromise on what the membership would prefer, what promotes the club on the highest level platform possible and not on any single members factor, preference or desire

[Tony Fearn]

Here's my thoughts.
Moises should be thanked for putting himself forward, (as Peter did for the Swiss Rally), as the prime mover for a Spanish Rally in September 2021.
It's not a decision he's taken lightly.
As I write, since this topic was started 9 days ago, there have been a total of 153 views. One from Scott, another from Peter, six from Keith and five from Chris. So that's four club members responding - (apart from this post), and mostly Keith and Chris.
I wonder what the other 149 viewers think, some of whom may be Club members.
I tend to lean towards Chris's arguments, but perhaps Moises' offer should be opened up to a wider, dedicated audience using the Jowetteer magazine as a vehicle for discussion.
As you know, I have a couple of pre-war cars, and I personally couldn't countenance such a return mileage from the North-West of England, and the cost of overnight stays there and back, although various Javelin and Jupiter owners may be more tempted.
I reckon on an average of 25 miles per hour on a pre-war vehicle, without stops, (I have to travel non-motorway) when I compute my itinerary and driving times to and from the National Rallies.
All this apart, what do the other 149 viewers think? As Chris says, it should be debated openly, but perhaps not only in this medium.
Tony.

[Forumadmin]

Those on Facebook may like to look at these posts by Moises on his current travels around possible places to visit.
Asturias is the most likely area we will visit.
If these links do not work for you , please let me know.
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_ ... 0253203870
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_ ... 0253203870
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_ ... 0253203870
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_ ... 0253203870

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_ ... 0253203870