George Mitchells CD Pickup.

Drummond Black · Post by **Drummond Black** » Mon Aug 28, 2006 8:51 pm

Pat The answer, unfortunely, is NO. It was scrapped in error many years ago. I remember it about 1966. It was fitted with a Javelin Engine and Gearbox..

Keith Andrews · Post by **Keith Andrews** » Tue Aug 29, 2006 8:46 am

Thew CD station wagon in NZ is still in the club storage/workshop at Kens place (Auckland)
It is in a very bad state of repair....A huge project to recover that I believe we dont have the finances to rebuild....
I have seen hot rod projects raise from worse raw material, so it is not a lost cause.
I belive the engine/running gear is alsao still there.

Bryan Walker · Post by **Bryan Walker** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 11:13 am

The CD bradford in the Auckland club shed.
Neil Moore also has one in his shed - I think it was in better condition when I saw it.

And here is the engine.

Bryan

Tony Fearn · Post by **Tony Fearn** » Thu Aug 31, 2006 2:04 pm

Pat, I think the display board behind the CD engine is showing a vintage (pre 1929) engine from one of the models that had no front brakes. They did have a transmission brake activated by the hand brake lever. Tony.

TedAllen · Post by **TedAllen** » Thu Aug 31, 2006 9:43 pm

Tonight I recieved a phone call from someone called Drummond Black about the CD bradford. I can't say I've ever heard of him but he seemed to know a bit about Jowetts !
In the 70s and 80s I owned the CD estate car which by then was the only one left in the hemisphere. This was a 1953 model reg no JKU 945. The log book showed its owners as Jowett Cars, Jowett Engineering, Blackburne Aviation and then Hawker Siddeleys..
The car had a massive chassis with Javelin front suspension and huge cart springs of about 10 leaves at the rear. Brakes were full Javelin hydraulic with drums drilled for 15 inch wheels. A Javelin engine had been fitted at some time but was not with the car. The bulkhead had a hole burnt in it for the column change. The front wings, front panel and bonnet were in very good condition but the bottom 6 inches of the doors and the rest of the body was rotten. The roof was attached to the body with the gutter in between and did not appear to be rustproofed so a nice triple decker rust sandwich had formed. The floors were plywood on steel top hat sections...also rusted away. The 2 seats were taken from luxury cars of the 50s or 60s but did not match. All the glass was flat, there were no wind down windows just lift and drop by hand. The headlamps were 7inch Joseph Lucas ( the prince of darkness) and the other lights probably came from the Lucas catalogue. The colour was a dark, drab, rough blue but some inspection panels that would have been protected by carpet were a nice pale greeny-blue. I wonder if that was original.
I obtained the car from Pauline Holliday ( ex Wright) in Bishops Castle as a swap for a CB. The rust was too much for me at the time, (no MIG) and I lost interest to concentrate on my Javelin ( which I still have).
I sold the car to someone in Essex and delivered it on my transporter. The last I heard was that it now lived in the Yorkshire area and the body had been restored and painted. Any questions, just ask. Can't guarantee answers though !

Bryan Walker · Post by **Bryan Walker** » Sun Sep 03, 2006 10:08 am

Had a look at Cd18 yesterday (it's located at Neil Moore's place) Also an estate car as above but in better condition.
It still has the 4 cylinder engine installed.
What is interesting about the engine is that the sump is a lot deeper and corrugated on the bottom.

TedAllen · Post by **TedAllen** » Sun Sep 03, 2006 4:53 pm

Just a note I forgot to mention that my cars chassis no. was E3 CD 10.
I checked the DVLA database but JKU 945 comes up as 'not known'

.

Post by **Forumadmin** » Sun Sep 03, 2006 11:01 pm

Surprised you do not remember Drummond; once seen or heard, never forgotten. Yes, I suppose you could say he knows a little about Jowetts!

TedAllen · Post by **TedAllen** » Sun Sep 03, 2006 11:46 pm

Only kidding...He's been one of my best friends for about 32 years now.
Anyway...who could forget him !!!

Bryan Walker · Post by **Bryan Walker** » Fri Sep 22, 2006 10:04 am

The pickup referred to was originally obtained by George Mitchell at the Batley wash up about 1963.
He had it for a number of years and apparently had it at some 're-builder' in scotland?. It got left there during his marriage break up 'sideshows'.
The story as I understand it is, that the chassis and most of the running parts disappeared at this time, and who ever went to reclaim it when they got there, only the Cab and the tailgate of the tray remained. I don't know over what time frame this happened but as with most of the other "valuable"( to we jowetters anyway) Jowetts George had they quietly rusted away.
The Cab and tailgate were rescued however and went through a number of hands ending up with the late Tony Palmer at the old Jowett spares site (His premises for his electrical business) until his untimely death late 2002.

When I made enquires later the next year Ed Nankivell sadly had to relate that Tony's son in the inevitable cleanup following, deemed the cab too rusty and with no JC ???? consigned it to the tip. I believe the tailgate still survives.
As you will appreciate this was a sad blow after 50 odd years of keeping at least the cab alive regardless of its state! I had hopes of supplying Tony with a new chassis when we get to the stage of rebuilding CD17&18 as my now retirement project. However very good photos remain!! The Number of the Ute I believe was E2CD3 and colour Ford Green.

The Remaining CD's
CD10 - Van Remains in UK with Simon Wood (4cyl)
CD11 - Van Almost restored in Ray Wins Collection NZ (4cyl)
CD17 - Estate car (van) Northern Branch NZJCC - Sad - (2cyl)
CD18 - Estate Car (van) Neil Moore not quite so Sad (4cyl) NZ
CD2R3 - Now 4 seat Jupiter sports - Vic Morrison NZ - only one running

CD2&CD18 have R4 motors, CD17 is only 2cyl, rest javelin engines

Keith Andrews · Post by **Keith Andrews** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 3:07 am

I was up at Neil Moore's yesterday...meant to take the camera to grab some pics of his to post...It does need a lot of body work but basically everything is there.
Neil is and has been a huge technical contubuter to Jowetts for ....well since history began with the big bang lol
But no matter how much I try to convince him, he will not get email or internet...So he gets posts in hard forum rights out replies and we post/comment on his behalf...
Hopefully I will get over his place again this week and get some pics.

Alastair Gregg · Post by **Alastair Gregg** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 6:17 pm

I was thumbing through a 1995 Membership list of the JCC the other day and found the following regarding CD Bradfords and it mentions a couple of Chassis numbers that Bryan didn't but then hey its 11 years ago and I know very little about the CD so the following is as per the Membership list:-
CD 1 "The Tram" Estate 4 door Metallic grey GKY 540 1951 scrapped.

CD2 Briggs Bodied Utility Duck egg blue HKW 272 1952 Now in NZ owned by V Morrison NZ reg LK 3625 rebuilt with Jupiter style body called CDR3 with R4 engine

CD3 Pick up Pastel green HKY 566 1952, owned A Palmer

CD4 2 Door Saloon Metallic Green JKU 399 1953 scrapped

CD10 Utility JKU 945 1953 owned by F Livesy

CD11 Utility/estate with R4 engine was grey now maroon owned by Sid Bradford NZ Reg EW 9022

CD13 Van Black or Dark Blue possibly JKW 66 Dumped

CD17 Utility Pale green Now in NZ reg EW 7071

CD 18 Possibly a utility metallic green now in NZ owned by steve wickens Javelin engine

I'm not guranteeing any accuracy but that is what the JCC thought in 1995

Wouldn't it be great to find one in England!!!!!

george garside · Post by **george garside** » Sun Oct 01, 2006 10:16 pm

re very interesting frontal phot of Cd engine, can our friends in NZ provide any furthur info on the following points
1. Is the crankcase the same as the CC, it looks similar but different to me and this is born out by phot in complete jowett history which shows a sort of web going accross the top of the crankcase.
2. is the crankshaft the same as Cc - if different in what way
3. has anybody any idea of the CD compression ratio
4 has anyone any idea of the torque curve of the cd
5 from the available photos of the cd engine there does not seem to be aany scope for a water pump and therefore it was presumably not considered necessary to fit a heater in 1952/3 (when the Cd should have hit the market. This seems a bit odd as it was around that time that most makers started to offer heaters as extras & athat was presumably one of the reasons that Ford added a water pump to their redisigned 1172cc motor in the 100E. Does the NZ Cd twin estate have any sign of any sort of heeater or holes for the fitting thereof.

just a thought but the CD with , i understand, 34bhp (at ?rpm) offered more or less the same output per litre as the javelin. Why didn't Jowetts make bigger holes in the pots and go for 1200cc and around 40+bhp which would have given a very competative 70 mph or so top speed and two lovely big bangs.
If only!
george

Keith Andrews · Post by **Keith Andrews** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 8:47 pm

Sry about the delay in pics of the Neil Moore CD in NZ...

Bryan Walker · Post by **Bryan Walker** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 10:53 am

Hi Pat,
Both CD's in Auckland sadly are parked making it hard to get a photo of the the rear doors- but next time I'm at Neil's or the shed I'll see if I can.

Not shown in these photos is the sump on the 4cly - a lot deeper than the standard jav or jup. sump.

Bryan

JowettTalk

George Mitchells CD Pickup.

CD18

CD Bradford

Drummond

Reply From Neil Moore(NZ) on CD Ute

CD ownership