Jupiter headlights

[114]

I'd be glad of some expert advice please.
Our early 51 RHD Jupiter was exported directly from the factory to the USA and only re-imported last year.
It was naturally by then fitted with right dipping moden light units.
I have replaced these with modern left dipping units for legality but would like to fit something correct for the period.
2 lLucas catalogues covering differing periods but both including the. The 51 model year give conflicting gen
One states P700 (non tripod) for 1951 RHD cars, then PF770 thereafter, wheras the other states PF770 for all model years.
My Jowett parts catalogue is from 52so is of no definitive help.
Many thanks

[Andrew Henshall]

I have a listing of all Lucas parts fitted to Jupiters from 1951-54, and it shows the headlights as follows:

RHD UK vehicles (Dip left) 1951: Lucas Part number 50825A (Early PF770)
RHD UK vehicles (Dip left) 1952-54: Lucas part number 51121 (Late PF770 Mk II)
RHD Export vehicles (Dip left) 1951: Lucas Part number 50825A (Early PF770)
RHD Export vehicles (Dip Left) 1952-54: Lucas Part number 51121 (Late PF770 Mk II)

The differences between the early PF770 and later PF770 Mk II is in these components: backshell, gasket, inner seating rim, retaining rim, retaining wire, and the fixing screws, clips, and springs.

These headlights on my Jupiter E1SA433R (which left JCL on 31 Oct 1951) are Lucas PF770 Mk IIs (Tripods). The PF770 lights are 7.7 inches diameter.

The Lucas P700 are 7.0 inch diameter headlights, and I've never seen a Jupiter fitted with these headlights.

Cheers,

Andrew

[114]

Andrew, thanks. Looks as if my Lucas book may be in error.
Do you by chance know a good source for those very rare PF770s?
Cheers.
Roger

[Srenner]

I have used ones from this supplier twice. Originals are better made overall, but these look nice once installed. My critique is that the originals have sharper creases in the reflectors and finer assembly.

http://www.billtracyjaguar.com/headlights1.html

[Andrew Henshall]

I've not purchased from them, but Holden Vintage & Classic spares in Bromyard Herefordshire list the correct Lucas PF770 Tripod light unit assemblies for Jowett Jupiter (without the logo in the centre) at GBP175 ea ex VAT. These units have the correct flat plain (clear) glass.

See: https://www.holden.co.uk/displayproduct ... de=010.192

They also list a complete set of parts for both early and late type PF770 MKII lamps, so if you pick up a pair of PF770s at an autojumble or swap, you can restore them, providing you are able to open them up. The brass reflector is rolled over the edge of the glass and has to be unrolled to open the unit. It is possible to do this if you are very careful and have the right tools, but it can only be done once or twice and then the lip snaps off.

There are people who advertise the restoration of these units: I had mine restored locally (Melbourne Australia) and instead of silver plating the reflectors, we had them plated with rhodium, which looks just like silver but does not tarnish.

Cheers,

Andrew

[Forumadmin]

Andrew great advice. We had Peter's Jav lights rechromed but the unpicked rim was so hard that it would not bend back and the glass cracked. Mortified that these rare early lights were irreplaceable I found some available from China but also some from a BSA supplier 8 miles away. However went for a later H4 model that had LHD dip option and high power LED units.

[Andrew Henshall]

I believe that the only reliable way to peel back the edge of the reflector from the glass is to use a dedicated mount for the light unit in a lathe, and gently apply a rolling tool held in the toolstock while rotating the light slowly. The same process is used to re-seat the glass & seal during re-assembly. The guy who did mine managed to not only not crack any parts off the reflectors, but also did not damage to the flat glass "lenses" which amazingly were in perfect condition as received, and so could be re-used.

Because the PF770 MkII lights are quite rare, and replacements are not cheap, I decided that I needed to fit stone-guards to them. I also didn't want to risk having to open them up again to replace a glass in case the rolled edge of the reflector cracked off. I found that no-one globally makes traditional stainless wire mesh guards to suit PF770s, and so I made some guards out of 3mm UV stable polycarbonate (which doesn't scratch too easily) and mounted them on small stainless steel brackets which clip under the outer rim and are aligned exactly with the legs on the tripod behind the glass.

These guards can be removed in a minute or so for concour judging simply by removing the bottom screw that clamps the outer rim in place.

The photo below shows the light unit with the guard in place from directly ahead, which shows that it is virtually invisible.

DSC02696_s.jpg

The photo below shows the light unit from the side to give you an idea of how the retaining clips work.

DSC02711_s.jpg

Cheers, Andrew

[Forumadmin]

Stone guards are needed more in Aus than the UK but are a good idea. Some people cover their prized cars at the front with a plastic protector to prevent stone chips and fly damage. Somewhat detracts from the look though and is only of benefit at resale when you take it all off.

[Andrew Henshall]

Yes Keith, stone guards are a very good idea in Australia even if you keep off our many thousands of miles of gravel roads, simply because our rural bitumen roads are in appalling condition - the surfaces a very broken due to decades without any maintenance. Only the major freeways are in acceptable condition, but these do not even stretch as far as the state capitals in many cases! We usually try to avoid driving our Jowetts on the freeways, and stick to the less traveled rural roads, and hence have to dodge the many potholes, areas of broken surface, missing road-edges, etc. It is very common to have a stone hit your car when a vehicle passes in the opposite direction. Because a roadworthiness test is required in order to sell a car, and the rules regarding chips in the windscreen are very strict, it is normal to have to replace the windscreen in order to pass the roadworthiness test, even on fairly new cars!

[CyrilWhite]

Noticed an ad on ebay, Demon Tweeks offering tri pod headlights , no details of size , might be of interest £87 pair if right size.

[Forumadmin]

Wrong size 7 inch. But you can get conversion kit which I have on SA from MG.

[AmilcarJohn]

Try Keith Ardley in Ely who sells reconditioned original PF770 lamps from stock. I bought a set of slight seconds at an attractive price and they give a very strong light when fitted with halogen bulbs. Keith also sells the bulb holders, wiring connections, rubber seals, bulbs etc. I used these lamps to replace the 7" tripod conversion previously fitted and they look much more attractive in my opinion. I don't like to post the contact details on a public forum, but message me and I will be happy to send the email contact.

[Keith Clements]

https://www.motorbase.com/contact/by-id/878530863/
Has contact details for Keith Ardley

[Alastair Gregg]

I have used Keith Ardley and had exceptional service. A replacement PF770 glass with me in 3 days was one example.

Alastair

[114]

Thanks very much indeed forr all the advice!
Roger