Recommissioning 1929 long two

[george garside]

For what its worth its probably not so much the engine sitting lower but of your chassis sitting higher than that of a 1934 car! .It therefore has the same problem as the fixed head engine. However, looking at your photos I may just be possible to remove a head by undoing one mount and loosening t'other and then jacking up the cylinder whose head is to be removed as the fat part of the head is above the chassis rail. Or maybe using two jacks aand raising one side and slightly lowering the other rather than the large amount of rotation needed on the vintage engine which was necessary as the whole barrel had to be withdrawn from the crankcase.

george

[BarryCambs]

So I am correct in thinking a 1934 engine in a 1934 car, you can slide the heads off without moving the engine?

If the studs on the thinner part of the head are shorter, then I think you might be right and it could be possible to lift it just far enough. I ordered an adapter for my compression tester tonight, so if there isn't any damage yet, it is worth trying to get that valve out and grinding a bit off the stem. If it is blowing, it could be the seats need cutting or replacing anyway. Still a bit suspicious at the find of the new valves and head gaskets in the boot.

The throttle linkage has a brazed joint in it and then a large hump about 4 inches above the carb. Very odd looking and flapping around. The pivot through the carb lever is a threaded part of the rod, forming the bearing. I have found some nice brass ball joints online which I can use at the carb end. The pedal itself is a lot lower than the clutch. Is this right, or should they be level?

The accelerator isn't connected in this picture of the old floor (now replaced) which had slots crudely cut to bring the pedals back further. The brake was impossible to get a foot on and the lever had gone over centre. I have had to cut a short slot in the new floor for the clutch to get enough travel, but it is still comfortable and lower than the brake, which now sits vertical.

I notice on the parts list the clutch pedal is bolted straight to the shaft at the bell housing, but this car has a cross shaft running under the floor with linkage to the bell housing shaft.

[george garside]

on a '34 both the heads and barrels can be removed with the engine in situ and the complete head removal valve replacement and refit of head can be done at the side of the road in about half an hour.

the vintage cars did indeed have the clutch pedal attached to the clutch shaft in the bellhousing but the 30's models had the shaft as you describe. It looks as if a lot of work went into the 'conversion'

As I mentioned the throttle linkage was most rudimentary perhaps thereis a photo of it on here somewhere

george

[Tony Fearn]

Hi Barry.
I've just been to the garage to check the cylinder head on 'Mary Ellen' (1934), and I've made a rough sketch of the position of the head relative to the chassis web cross-section. You will see that there should be enough room to take off the head if the studs are of original length.

I presume the front wings are still off the car.
The cylinder mounting bracket look a bit odd.

It pays to use new cylinder-head nuts if the old ones are splayed by being used time and time again. There won't be enough grip in the threads to really tighten them down.

Tony.

[BarryCambs]

Thanks Tony. The vintage chassis must be a little bit wider at the front then for my engine to sit between the rails. Given my problems with the steering column length, presumable an entirely different set up.

I'll see if Jowett Spares have the head nuts, so thanks for the tip. I missed calling them tonight to ask about track rods.

We're not sure when the conversion was done. The earliest log book I have is 1950 and it certainly had the current engine number then. That would mean the donor car could only be 15 years old at most and I guess it was pretty badly damaged, as I thought cars might have been in short supply during and after the war and not scrapped lightly. As our car was in london for the war, my dad wondered if the donor was bomb damaged!

Ron who owned the cat after the war, was a car enthusiast and my Dad's cousin told me did like speed. She remembered a terrifying journey across Romney Marsh in his 30s Bentley, the Jowett being his daily driver. I can only assume the original engine came to the end of the road and he decided it was better to "upgrade", rather than rebuilding what was there.

[george garside]

there is a decent photo of the 1934 throttle linkage ( just a singe rod) on Julians kestrel rebuild thread 15th nov

george

[richard turner]

Removing the heads on a mid 30's car is in my experience tricky! Removal of bell housing bolts and then rotate engine to access head. Wiring and ancillary bits should be disconnected, removed as required. Rich

[BarryCambs]

Thanks Rich. I have access to an engine hoist, so if it needs the barrels off for valve seat work, I think I would just take it out and do it on the bench now.

[BarryCambs]

I assumed I had half a 1930s throttle rod connected to half a 1929 one. Looking at it now, I think it's just a shortened 1929 rod, but the large raised hump causes the whole thing to flap about and this has damaged the lever on the carb already. Thanks for pointing out the picture of the kestrel. I will fabricate one along those lines.

The photo is form before any work was started

Tony, is your accelerator level with the clutch for more comfortable driving, or did the later cars have the throttle to the right?

Barry

[george garside]

it looks as if you just need to make up a more or less straight rod with a bend at the carb end to line up with the throttle arm aand a thread at the other end for the pedal. Have never seen one with a hump an can't see why it is required so suspect the hump was simply an cack handed attempt at shortening the rod!

Accelerator moved to right for 1935 model cars , not sure when on commercials but probably 1936 models

george

[BarryCambs]

You're probably right and "cack handed" is a pretty fair description of every single repair to the car. I'm hoping my own workmanship will stand up better to scrutiny. It does have a brazed join in the rod for good measure. This could have been done at the same time 3 pieces of wire were joined with chock blocks to get the choke cable to reach.

[ian Howell]

On my 1930 engine the throttle rod is as George describes but it has a bend in the middle so that in part it lays along the top of the inlet/cooling manifold.

This did show some signs of slight chafing on the manifold so I have put a bit of rubber tube over it at this point.

So -straight through the floorboards, bend along the manifold (with a rubber sleeve), bend back to align with the throttle arm where it is simply bent over for about 1" and drilled, with a split pin to keep it in place. Just like the brake rods.
Sorry, no pictures at present.

[BarryCambs]

Thanks Ian. I'll get myself some rod and see what I can do. Can you tell me how high your pedal is in relation to the clutch?

Barry

[george garside]

[quote="richard turner"]Removing the heads on a mid 30's car is in my experience tricky! Removal of bell housing bolts and then rotate engine to access head. Wiring and ancillary bits should be disconnected, removed as required. Rich[/quote]

I have never had any difficulty removing heads or barrels with the engine in situ on either 7 or 8 hp 30's models. If I remember rightly the barrels are removed ,after head removal, by pulling off crankcase studs turning engine (using flywheel) so the side to be removed is at BDC rotating barrel anti clockwise so it can be pushed back towards the crankcase with the flanges in between the studs (?about 1/8th of a turn) . the barrel can then be removed at an upwards aangle of ?30deg ish. In other words ...pull it out , make sure piston is at BDC, twist it anti clockwise , shove it back and left it off in an upwards direction.

To replace just reverse the procedure

george

[Tony Fearn]

Hello Barry.
Yes the accelerator pedal, between the clutch and the brake pedals is at the same height on my '34.
I will try to photograph the rod from the side and the top in the next couple of days and post it here.
As I said at the beginning of this saga all those months ago, the 'alterations' seem to be a right mishmash.
The brake pedal looks vintage whilst the clutch pedal seems to be pre-war as you've mentioned.
The lever to the gearbox on the latter, on my '34 lies against the footboard on the engine side, and this helps in the adjustment of the clutch toggles.
The brake lever may be just a tight fit at the bottom end, so keep the bolt tight after you've adjusted the brakes.

Where are you in the country? I've a feeling that the car at one time was near Daventry, but I've looked at the 2014 and the 2015 membership list and can't find you in it.
There's an Club AGM coming up in October near Daventry, so if you come to it with a load of photos of your car, perhaps the gathered vintaginists will be able to help you decide what's what.

Tony.

Ian H:- Hi. I had the same problem with the accelerator rod wearing at the manifold, so I changed the position of the return spring mount on the floor board, and it dragged the rod up and away from the manifold.