Footman James Get it Wrong Again

[Jack]

Well, what an interesting phone call that was. I just rang Footman James, because they left me a voicemail threatening to cancel my policy because they hadn't got my mileage on record.

They haven't got my mileage on record, because they have sent letters to an old address trying to get me to give them the mileage, instead of using the new address that was sent to them several weeks ago. They say they haven't received anything, or at least their system hasn't got a record of them receiving anything...

They very helpfully took details of my new address. They checked it, they asked me when I can get the mileage to them, everything was ok, then they decided to ask me for an admin fee for changing my address.

At this point I become confused. They want £20 to change an address on a computer screen in front of them. It costs them nothing to make that change. The phone call took 5 minutes, so unless the girl I spoke to is earning £120 per hour I can't see the justification for the cost. I don't need any new documents, nothing changes, just at renewal time instead of sending me a big pile of paper to one address, the computer writes a different address on it. My premium is under £200 per year, so they want more than 10% extra to change an address? They can update the mileage for free, because it suits them to try and catch out drivers going over their restricted mileage, but a simple address change seems to be dramatically more work.

People move house every day. My bank hasn't charged me. My other insurers haven't charged me, even the council haven't charged us (despite their budget cuts!) the only people so far to charge me for moving house is Footman James.

I think the insurance industry is going to see consumers starting to push back on this kind of thing, the banks have lost the ability to make exorbitant charges for overdrafts and the like, will consumers start claiming back all their admin fees from years of being bent over a barrel?

The outcome of this is that Footman James do not have my new address. They seemed ok with the idea of not bothering to update it, instead of trying to please the customer they decided that it would be easier just to not update their system. Ho hum. I guess they'll be getting a phone call to cancel the policy in a few months time when the policy runs out, and then we'll see if I renew with them or someone else. Given that they won't have my address to send the renewal docs to, and they have demonstrated just how much they value my business, I think I'll be looking to another supplier - out of interest for them perhaps Lancaster Insurance have my new address details and have contacted me a couple of times to see if I'll give them a go next time. I think I just might...

Is it about time we review whether Footman James are actually worth having as the club insurer? With stories of club members premiums doubling, and difficulties with the common sense we've seen from them in recent years, is it now time for us to explore other suppliers? With 700+ members our buying power is great, perhaps time for us to exert some of that buying power to see what else is out there. The club does benefit from the FJ relationship, but do we as members benefit too?

Jack.

[Jack]

Well this is fun. A letter arrived from Footman James demanding £20 because they have changed my address! Without me asking them to!

I wonder whether they'll agree that they have attempted to take money under false pretences.

Pure laziness on the part of the call centre staff. They realised I wasn't happy, and it was easier to just get rid of me, change the address, and let someone else deal with it, than to do the job properly and deal with the customer complaint.

Update to follow once I've spoken to them tomorrow. But frankly this isn't anywhere close to the customer service I expect from companies I am paying money to, especially ones that claim to "provide insurance for specialist vehicles at competitive prices and pride ourselves on our customer service" - I wouldn't be proud if I let my customers down like this.

Jack.

[Keith Andrews]

I have an on going issue with a subsistized home insulation package.....
Every phone call is backed by a email, and preferbly everting is done by email...not phone.
At the end of the day, and when/if the perverbial hits the fan...it boils down to evidence, and a phone call doesnt measure up.
Things like the job signed off and credits not given....on the face of it can or could very well be a back hand bit of corruption...I dont accus but certainly piont out how these things could be interpeted to as being....and piont out IF I was in their position that would be the logical way to do it...in writing.
If the perverbial does hit the fan...it always comes down to cold hard evidence....NOT what is correct or not.

[TedAllen]

I don't think FJ will be any different to most insurers, Jack. Customer loyalty seems to count for nothing now. I haven't used them for years. It's common practice now to stick up your premium quote on renewal in the hope that most folk will just roll over and pay up.
I've been with Sureterm Direct for a couple of years or so. They do 4WD and Classics. In anticipation of the Vitara quote being well up last Summer, I looked at a few comparison sites.......cheapest was a couple of hundred more than last year with Sureterm. I left it to see what their renewal quote would be and was surprised that it was a tenner less than last year, under £200 comp. The Javelin came in at the same cost as the previous year so I put the wife's Note with them as well.
Loyalty both ways.

I had occasion to change the reg no of the Vitara a few weeks later and, again, had the pleasure of not being charged any fee for it...although some paperwork was involved.

My quote for the bike's renewal was a hundred pounds more than last year. Comparison sites showed the same company quoting me £100 less. A phone call reduced my renewal by that £100 ! They just try it on all the time !

I suppose the classic insurance business is now spread amongst a lot more providers than it was 20 yrs ago so some must feel they have to make money on everything they do for you.

Ted

[Keith Andrews]

On the insurance side..well in NZ..I can get cheaper insurance thru 'classic insurance ' for the cars..but that limits my milage.
But it is still cheaper to go full cover along with the house contents etc etc as a bulk package deal.
Even so the premiums for the cars just dont relate to the values
The Bradford, full cover about 45K about (wife looks after this stuff) $180 per yr..
the Camaro $45K about $600 per yr
The wifes toyota 3.5 K 750/yr
thats with no claims and only limit drivers must be over 25 or nominated if under....2 children just under 25 still.

Looking back thru the camaro records 1980 thru 1995 premiums where between $480 and 550 /per valued at market value...around 15 to 30K proportionally it is now far cheaper now.

Its not all about "cheap" its about when the perverbial hits the fan, will your insurance company come to the party....over the last 30/40yrs, mine has..I have been stiaght up with them and visa versa...couple burglaries, the camaro stolen, engine, trans, diff, etc etc screwed that came to a good 18/20K.
We want something changed, 1 phone call done, few days later a letter confirming , no issues ..buy sell a car, add someone on the drivers list nps....
yet others have horror stories
And the common denominator, they are with cheaper companies..sometimes....but they to complain about hasstles with comunication, charges for this and that ....food for thought...

[Forumadmin]

I reckon FJ are still the best deal for Jowett insurance and the club get a useful injection with every car insured.
If anybody can give an example of comparable cheaper, then please give details.

[Jack]

Just dragging up my delightful experience to add to it. I have now been on hold for half an hour just to speak to someone, anybody, to cancel my policy.

How does one leave a company that you can't contact to tell them not to renew your policy??? Great service. Two phone calls. No response to either.

Their offices close at 5:15. It says as much on their website. Is there a special number we can call that they actually pick up?

I am increasingly convinced that the parent company has told FJ to increase premiums and avoid investing in customer service because compared to the rest of their business insuring our little cars isn't profitable enough for them.

Jack.

[Jack]

Have now got through to speak to a human being, who referred me to another human being to help me with my simple renewal cost query. They very kindly offered to double my premium for me. That's right. Double it. From this year at £172.62 they have very kindly referred to the underwriters and come back with a very competitive £350.

Of course I mean very competitive in the sense that they are competing with John Wayne and Clint Eastwood as greatest cowboys of all time. Laughably bad. I look forward to sharing my experience at the AGM in October.

Needless to say I just cancelled that policy. I will insure with any other company that I can find other than FJ in future. I honestly don't think we can trust people who operate this way. A small increase might be reasonable. But DOUBLE?

In fairness to them, had they insured me, I am pretty sure we'd be getting our money's worth out of their breakdown cover anyway. Except I have RAC membership for that to cover me for all the other vehicles I might need to drive in any given year...

Jack.

[george garside]

sounds like FJ in common with many other many other large insurers suffer from acute 'notgivashititis''. Perhaps this poor attitude is encourged by many clubs , including the JCC, recommending them as what many members may interpret as being official 'club insurers', This to some members may be taken as an indication or recommendation that they are the best company to deal with and that they offer the best terms!

Of course most clubs like or perhaps need the commision income but would it not be more in members interests to recommend members to seek several quotes and if neessary to cover the lost commission by asmall increase in subs . Another way might be to get FJ or whoever to agree in writing to beat any like for like quote in retturn for the clubs recommendation..

Just a thought!

george

[Chris Spencer]

I realise that Malcolm has put a lot of hard work into the FJ releationship but over the last 18 months it is as through FJ do want our business - I base this on my own experience:

In 2010 / 2011 I had our two moderns & a classic insured with FJ through the club scheme the cost was £850 - in 2011 FJ wanted £1980 ! for the renewal - no claims - no accidents - whilst realising that the insurance market had increased premiums accross the board I managed to insure the two moderns with another brand name insurer for a little over £1240 and FJ retained the classic with a premium of £130- £1370 in total and way below the FJ premium

The renewal on the classic for 2012 through FJ would have been £198 - a £68 increase and at this point I shopped around - I now have the Rover insured through 'Haggerty' who use 'Hiscox' as the underwiter - result £105 ! for a better policy - they accepted my photos as proof of my own valuation - have no problems with salvage retention - forigen or young drivers - and only insure classic / vintage cars so you are not suppoting every other claim for the cracked bath / sick dog polices.

They are a friendly bunch of guys (we caught up with then on their stand at Goodwood) - all staff in the office own a classic of some discripition - and they run a club scheme if we are interested - I think it's time that FJ were shown a clean pair of heals - it is obvious that they are not interested in our business.

[Alf Heseltine]

I thought my 40% increase was high, but compared to Jack & Chris obviously not. With our cars shouldn't increased premiums be about
the same, with a variation for value & risk.
In Jacks case it might be worth asking for an explanation from Martyn Raybould at F.J. who must have their reasons.

Alf.

[Jack]

I thought my 40% increase was high, but compared to Jack & Chris obviously not. With our cars shouldn't increased premiums be about
the same, with a variation for value & risk.
In Jacks case it might be worth asking for an explanation from Martyn Raybould at F.J. who must have their reasons.

Alf.

Hi Alf,

It might be of interest for other members, but I won't deal with FJ again. To attempt a 100% increase is quite frankly offensive to me - if we are a club which is in partnership with FJ, this doesn't feel much like a partnership to me. It feels like being bent over a barrel - lucky for us there are lots of other companies who are very keen to engage with the JCC, I guess we open conversations with them to see what they can do.

Jack.

[Keith Andrews]

Why wait till AGM to sort this out?
Surely the interst shown and case studies here is enough for Exective to communicate with FJ asking what has happened to previous arangements with the club...If existed...and informational link to this page ?
Didnt there used to be alink to them at the top of the page????
not there now?

lucky for us there are lots of other companies who are very keen to engage with the JCC, I guess we open conversations with them to see what they can do

And should not the excetive be looking into this...to report back for consideration at a AGM or if time frame not approiate, for consideration of local exectives?

[Chris Spencer]

In Jacks case it might be worth asking for an explanation from Martyn Raybould at F.J. who must have their reasons.

Why waste our time - FJ can not be bothered even to answer the telephone promptly - they are simply not interested in our business it's time to vote with our feet - and many have done just that already !

[TedAllen]

Interesting topic. I stopped using FJ years ago due to unrealistic increases in premium. I don't think they're any different to other companies. There doesn't seem to be any loyalty to customers and this has resulted in no loyalty back.
I had the Jowett and the 4WD insured with Sureterm direct, supposed classic and 4WD specialists. I put Ann's Note with them as well, although their quote for that wasn't the cheapest. This year they wanted about a grand more for the Vitara so they've now lost 3 accounts !

For the last 2 years I've insured the 600cc bike with Swinton...about £100 each time. They phoned me a renewal quote last Thursday of £175. After some haggling and a threat to find someone else, I got a discount of £20 and a cashback of £50. Just tell me £100ish early in the call and save both our time ?

As an aside, It might be useful to our UK members to check the Motor Insurers online database regularly. I check monthly and was disturbed, last Wednesday evening, to get the Vitara flagged up as uninsured. I renewed in July, paying in full. The bike and the Note were OK, the Jowett sorned at the moment. The following morning, the insurer, 1st Central, received a call asking for explanation...none was forthcoming and he told me it would be back on within 7 days ( not including the weekend ).
He suggested , if stopped, I asked the police to ring and they would confirm insurance.....yeah, sure, on a Sunday morning...I don't think so. I had to use the car on Friday as a job came in which needed comprsser/trolley jack. I didn't fancy taking those on the tram ! I had a little frisson of nervousness but didn't see a police car. Not bothered about static cameras, they don't seize your motor ! I kept it off the road for the rest of the time and let Ann chauffeur me about.

I was back on by Wednesday. Just got back from a biking weekend in Brecon where I met up with an old pal, a recently retired traffic cop. I asked him about seizure procedures. He said most of the younger men just didn't think for themselves and would believe the computer. He favoured assessing the car/driver, sometimes asking if there was another car in the family and seeing if that was insured. If there was no problem and the people looked and acted OK then he would issue a producer ticket and send them on their way. He reckoned the ASKMID database was only 85% up to date at any given time !

So, well worth a check every so often on all your vehicles !

Ted