'New' old Javelin

Tim Neville · Post by **Tim Neville** » Tue Nov 07, 2006 5:43 pm

Hello. Further to our initial introduction, we are now in a position to give all you good Javelin people out there a bit of information about us.
'Us' is me Tim and my son Ben. We are in North Devon near Hartland.
Last Sunday we completed a horrendous 644 mile round trip to pick up the Javelin I have just bought from north Cambridgeshire! 4am. start and finally got the Javelin into the garage at 9pm.
In 1968 my first car was a Javelin, it was a great car and I loved it, being lads me and my mates were always working on it, including 'hotting' it up using a Jupiter engine and many 'mods' the details of which Iam afraid I don't remember, except for two major events ;...
One, doing 106 m.p.h. on the old Kingston bypass in Surrey and very very nearly coming a cropper when (of course) she wouldn't stop!!
Two, fiddling about with the oil filter nut whilst the engine was going and catching my left hand in the fan. This deposited me in hospital! Fortunately I do still have my hand, but it still carries the scar.
She was a 1953,dark blue (a respray as I recall), but I'm afraid I can't remember the reg. or chassis number etc. I sold her 1969 I think for Â£80.
After years of telling my boys about my Javelin days I decided some years ago to try and get one again. Now I have!
1950. Deluxe. E0/PB/9639. Engine.ditto. Date of original Reg. 3rd. August. 1950. In dry storage since 1974. Complete and all (as far asI can tell) original. I have the original log book (I'm the 4th. owner), the Instruction Book, List of Spare Parts and a large part of the Workshop Manual.
I have been amazed at the overall condition; she is fundamentally sound all over (and under!), some rust underneath of course but so far nothing awful. The paintwork is poor and there is surface rusting which will have to be checked before we get rubbing and painting.
Firstly we just want to stabilise things and clean underneath.
We would most definitely appreciate all help and advice as to the best plan of attack from all you experts out there!! No rush, I think this is going to take some time!
Our JCC application is in the post.

David Morris · Post by **David Morris** » Tue Nov 07, 2006 6:29 pm

Hi Tim and Ben,

Firstly, a big welcome! ( or perhaps it should be 'welcome back' to the Jowett family )

If I have been following eBay correctly, is your 'new' car the one sold a couple of weeks ago by an eBayer called Frank Hornsby?

If so, I must say it looked very fair from the illustrations and seemed to just need a polish to be ready for the road again? ( Here's me being hopeful )

I am sure you will get lots of excellent advice from the club and this website. Just ask and we shall all try and help.

One point right now is that your car is a fairly early one, and certainly started out with hydro-mechanical brakes. These were changed for full hydraulic at chassis number E0/PB/10594.

There is nothing wrong with the early system, but there were several obvious and major changes to the brakes as well as significant changes to the front hubs and the rear axle etc. at the same time, so this makes quite an impact on ordering spares etc.

As your car has kept the original engine and seems to have been in a bit of a time warp, it is really is quite a special 'barn find' and I am sure she will repay you and Ben with lots of fun.

All the best with your exciting project. Don't forget to let us all know how it is going. We look forward to seeing you and the car soon.

All the best,

David

Tony Fearn · Post by **Tony Fearn** » Tue Nov 07, 2006 6:32 pm

Hello Tim and Ben. Just seen your last post, so welcome to the JCC. It's money well spent. I received the monthly Jowetteer (newsletter) a couple of days ago and in the part which deals with all the different Sections of the Club and what they are getting up to, I noticed that the South West Section, to which I suppose you will owe alliegence, (sounds a bit mediaeval does that) is having the final meeting of the year on the 19th November. This will consist of the Annual Section Lunch at Bickleigh Mill on the A 396 Exeter to Tiverton road. The contact point if you wish to start Jowetteering even before the ink's dry on your membership card is Christine or Geoff Wills on 01803 557924. What a way to begin again. Regards, Tony. ... Nice one Dave, you just beat me to it.

dougie · Post by **dougie** » Wed Nov 08, 2006 12:52 pm

Hi Tim and Ben,from Australia.
I'm sure the club will be most helpful in getting the beast back to full glory.
Ask for all the help you need here,the forum is full of knowledgable Jowett fanatics.

My Javelin is E0 PB7812 so it's a bit older than yours,but I remember bringing her home in 1971,35 years or so ago and now there is a Bradford and a Jupiter in the shed as well.
The Jowetts are part of the family and I can't imagine them not being with us.
Good Luck and have fun.

Keith Andrews · Post by **Keith Andrews** » Wed Nov 08, 2006 7:33 pm

A matter of ' male mid age crisis'

or
'Boys dont grow up, there toys just get bigger and more expensive"

Regardless, good find..
Matching nunbers car? orginal....
I know this is not a big issue in the UK as far as valuation/resto goes, But rare. A potentual genuine concourse car.
Matching numbers cars in most places of the world, restored or not add 25 to 50% to the value...I have a classic, matching numbers/papers, without these about $NZ45.000...with $65.000 and thats from a classic car valuer for insurance purposes. If I shiped to the 'States it would pull around 2x that price.
More important thu, is the bragging rights.

Steps

Tim Neville · Post by **Tim Neville** » Wed Nov 08, 2006 8:10 pm

Hello All.
Thanks to David Morris about the brakes. I was able to go down in a pit and look at the underside before I bought, so I was able to see this in fact.
Keith Andrews seems to think I'm suffering a mid-life 'situation' -- he might be right!!
The advantage of matching numbers and being original was uppermost in my mind when I was looking to buy.
I didn't mention that when we went to fetch the car the seller connected a battery, pressed the starter and guess what? Yep, it ran. She did come to a stop after a few moments, but she sounded ok. Turning the engine on the crank she feels good with nice compression and the oil looks good.

Keith Andrews · Post by **Keith Andrews** » Wed Nov 08, 2006 8:36 pm

When picking up and old car...
Before firing
Replace fuel, oil, engine/gearbox/diff/ brakes/filters (use a cheap recycled oil)...basically a full service regardless of what the oils look like
Check fuel lines and connections, torques on heads/cylinders/manifolds.
Check bottom radiator hose for corrossion on the reenforcing spring inside it and flush the cooling system.
Warm up, even take for a carefull drive but dont trust the brakes!!!
If all likes like a good runner, then change the oils again with a better quailty...the running will loosen up crap in the engine etc, need to get rid of this.
The main concern on cars sitting for long periods is the brakes and worn/perished steering/suspension/bearings drive line components...
Cheers
Steps

ian Howell · Post by **ian Howell** » Wed Nov 08, 2006 8:56 pm

'Devon Jowett' -

Check out the Memorabilia section of Jowett Talk - you might be able to do yourself / the club a favour!

Tim Neville · Post by **Tim Neville** » Thu Nov 09, 2006 11:14 pm

Hi there, its Ben (the other half of Devonjowett as it were), just thought i would make an introduction myself and say "hi" to everyone!
Ill start off with a question, although all the panels and the underside of the car are solid, bar the spare wheel compartment, there is a lot of surface rust, and as its sitting in the shed i think it best to find a way of stabilizing this problem so it doesn't take hold before we get round to a respray and what not. So, whats the best way to keep the rust at bay?

Cheers

Keith Andrews · Post by **Keith Andrews** » Fri Nov 10, 2006 4:35 am

Several things determine the action u take
1/How sever is the surface rust? is it just surface or pitting?
2/How long before u start actually restoring
3/How/where is the vechcle stored till resto work compenses?

David Morris · Post by **David Morris** » Fri Nov 10, 2006 9:27 am

Hi Tim and Ben,

Regarding what to do about rusty surfaces, I suggest you have a look firstly at the Technical Handbook for the Javelin, Figures 34 & 35, along with pages 118 to 121. These give lots of things to look for and assess before you rush into any rust prevention.

If you don't have this handbook already, I suggest you get a copy before you do anything else, as it will give you a baseline on which to ask us all further questions. I am sure many in the club will agree that it is best to have a good read of other people's experiences and advice, before you jump in yourself. It is a super collection of all the best data and wisdom on Javelins put together, I believe, by the club in the 1970's/80's. You can download a copy by going onto the Jowett Club website, looking for Jowett.net and then looking for 'Technical'. The various assemblies of data for Javelin, Juptier, Bradford etc. will then be listed and are ready to be downloaded. The Javelin Handbook will give you lots of reading during those cold winter evenings!

I recommend you then have a good assessment of your car, once you have seen from the technical handbook where the likely rusty areas are to be found, and then go from there. If there really is just surface rust, and increadibly this might just be the case, then you will probably just need to get really dirty with wire brushes etc. and clean everything back to what was underneath the surface rust and mud. You might even find some factory paint in places! Surfaces exposed to water thrown up from the road then need to be given several coats of chassis paint, followed by a good surface anti-corrosion treatment, such as Dinatrol. All the box sections and hidden surfaces ( and there are lots of them! ) need injection with a a good wax anti-rust solution. I have found, from bitter experience, that things like the Waxoyl injection kits just don't work properly. You really need to spend a bit of money and purchase a compressor and a proper wax injection gun that works at the air line pressure. The difference is amazing and saves loads of frustration - believe me!

However, if you see that there is some evidence of rust in the more likely spots from your initial assessment, then it is probably best to do some pretty serious dismantling to eradicate deep rust in joints and known rust spots that will, unfortunately, just be waiting to be discovered. Rust is always worse the further you go. A surface clean now will probably only lead to more serious problems later. Don't be put off, however. Javelins, and especially for some reason, the early ones like yours, are made of thick stuff and can be remarkably solid. They are all over 50 years old now and have survived really well.

Anyway, the car sounds a really super project and we all wait eagerly to hear how you are getting on. Do keep on asking questions, we are all keen to help.

All the best,

David

pat lockyer · Post by **pat lockyer** » Fri Nov 10, 2006 10:12 pm

Hi Tim and Ben, i find over the years the best is to use old sump oil mixed with paraffin and then sprayed over and into the body chassis sections.
As for body paint with rust spots i will get back to you on a waterprof product that can be sprayed on to hold back the rust till you get to it.

Tony Fearn · Post by **Tony Fearn** » Sat Nov 11, 2006 1:03 am

Well now Tim and Ben. Don't suppose you ever expected replies from around the world! Have you booked in for the South West Section 'Christmas get together'? Don't forget to have a look at ALL the posts on this site. As David says, there's a vast amount of technical detail already available. Keith in NZ might tempt you to put a Camarro umpteem cc engine in tandem to your flat four, ( Pat L may moderate this, and KC might agree with either of them), but I suggest you wait a few years before going down that road. After all 2 mpg isn't what most of us can afford. Another thing - when you get your first Jowetteer, I hope you also get details of our Annual National Rally Weekend in May 2007. This time it will be in Cheshire, courtesy of our North West Section. It really is the one time you will be able to meet a significant number of like-minded Jowetteers, as well as having an absolutely splendid four days holiday with some really wonderful people. Don't worry if you have to come modern this time, the weekend will stimulate your interest in the restoration of your car. In my opinion, and I have been in the Club since 1962, you will never meet such a fantastic lot of enthusiasts as those in the JCC. But you don't need me to tell you this - you will realise it from the magazine and this website. By the way, we always have a stand at Beaulieu in September, another right good do! So here's to your Javelin re-birth. regards, Tony.

Keith Andrews · Post by **Keith Andrews** » Sat Nov 11, 2006 2:33 am

Keith in NZ might tempt you to put a Camarro umpteem cc engine in tandem to your flat four,

IMAO...

JCC ppl no matter where u are in the world are a great bunch...
Suire I spent many yrs in Hot Rodding and been ot of it for well over 12 yrs now. I joined up with JCC NZ about 5 or 6 yrs ago....its not Joweets that make the club what it is, it is the type of ppl, from all walks of life...just neat ppl who go that extra mile for others.
Steps

geoffwills · Post by **geoffwills** » Sat Nov 11, 2006 10:10 am

Hi Tim & Ben,

Tony Fearn is quie right (whenever wasn't he?). You should come along to the South West Section Annual Lunch. It is on the 19th November, near Tiverton. Space is now very short, so now would be a good time to call me on 01803 557924, or Email to Jowcars@talktalk.net to get the details.

Geoff Wills

JowettTalk

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