Spring into 2010 or Jemmima needs a Battery

[PaulB]

Hi Guy's,

I opened up a neighbours garage this morning, and found an old lady!

It's that time of year again, when Jemmima comes out of hibernation. The good news is. She's OK after here winter lay up. I had a job to get the engine to start but that's only to be expected.

The bad news is, her battery is dead, so I need a new one. I had to jump start her, using a secondary 12V battery.

Her battery has been on trickle charge through the winter, but I'm suspecting that it's that week in January, when we had severe temperatures that's killed it.

Or the charger is bust.

Can anybody on here recommend a good maintenance free battery suitable for our cars, preferably one which isn't expensive.

Thanks.

[Tony Fearn]

Hello Paul.

Had the same problem with 'Mary Ellen' recently.

Can't be doing with messing about with an almost defunct battery, so I went to Halfords and bought a new one, already charged - about £47.

Works a treat. I'll bet it will start the engines of the Vulcan bomber.

Don't forget to check what sort of +ve/-ve posts it has. M.E.s are the round type.

Better still, my mum-in-law bought it for my 66th birthday a couple of weeks ago!

See you at Wakefield.

Tony.

[Leo Bolter]

Better still, my mum-in-law bought it for my 66th birthday a couple of weeks ago!

Oh, you young fellahs are spoiled rotten these days . . . I haven't even got my lovely mum-in-law to do such kindly acts, any more!

By the way . . . my battery man suggests that sealed maintenance free batteries are not a good idea for use with a generator - especially 3 brush ones. Not being able to top-up the water in the battery is his reason. Addition of distilled water to the cells of the battery is more likely to be required because of the fairly crude method of charge regulation with these . . . as compared with alternators.

As we know, excess charging breaks the water component in the electrolyte down to Hydrogen and Oxygen and so the water must be replaced to maintain the electrolyte level on the plates and also its standard "strength" (Specific Gravity).

There endeth today's lesson

[PaulB]

Thanks Leo,

But I'm going with Tony's idea, buy it from Halfords. I'd like one that is more in-tune with our cars, but they are considerably expensive then a maintenance free battery.

I would also have pay postage as I would only be able to source one of those traditional batteries from the internet. But thank you any way for you're advice.

Tony,

Yes I must not forget the battery terminals, and I'll take the defunct battery with me for size.

With luck, I'll get the chance to go out and drive her on Sunday

[Robin Fairservice]

I asked a man who specialises in servicing automobile electrical equipment and he said that he couldn't think why a maintenance free battery would have a problem. I asked about the regulator and he said that it controls output rather than input. Possibly there might be some concerns with a 6 volt system.

[Forumadmin]

Robin, your electrical man does not know what he is talking about or you misunderstood.

It does control output; but of the dynamo or generator. All batteries can be destroyed by overcharging, some are more sensitive than others.

You need to know the technology employed with the battery chosen to decide if it is suitable. Suggest some web research!

Two parameters are important - maximum charge current, and overcharge resilience. Too much current overheats and distorts plates and boils off electrolyte. Overcharge sensitivity 'sulphates' plates and blocks them off from conducting. The charge rate depends on voltage in most regulators(except NI-Cd) and different technologies have different charge voltages.

[Tony Fearn]

Well, - Mary Ellen's previous battery was bought in 2003, so it didn't do too badly, although I don't do mega-miles in her per year these days.

Althought some batteries are labelled as maintenance free, I've a feeling that they might just have screw type stoppers or the like, which you can remove to check the state of the electrolyte level every now and then.

With the third brush type dynamo, perhaps moving the 3rd brush to give a lower input might be of use, especially as the summer is almost here and extended use of lights might not be a problem. There's a little screw on the back plate which when loosened allows you to move the brush around. The main problem is that you might just need to remove the floorboards to get to it. When you do, drill a little hole in the floorboard so that the next time the brush needs adjusting, you'll only need to pull up the carpet.

There's also the winter/summer charge rate to play with on the PLC switch, the winter charge has a greater amperage input which shows on the ammeter.

Tony.

P.S. Thanks for the 'young fellah' Leo, it's taken years off me!

[Alastair Gregg]

Jowetts were always ahead of their time but a PLC in a pre war!!!!


PLC nowadays is used to describe a Programmable Logic Controller or a small computer that is fitted to each machine in a production environment to enable it to talk to another machine so they can decide between them for example to speed up or slow down.

[george garside]

certainly some sealed batteries aren't!. A few years ago in France the diesel car I was using to tow a caravan refused to start after a few days idle on the campsite. Not even enough juice in the battery to turn it over. I phoned green flag (in Leeds!) & within 20 minutes a 'garagist' arrived,swiftly diagnosed the problem, tore the label off the top of the battery & bellow this was a plastic 'lid' that fitted along the sells, He prised this off with a large sscrewdriver, filled the battery with something called l'eau which must have had majical properties as he then jump started the car telling me to drive non stop for 10km. The battery lasted another 2 years despite being topped up regularly with plain English l'eau! So it pays to have a look under the top label of sealed for life batteries.

george

[Leo Bolter]

Gidday, ladies and gents.

Really sealed . . . for ever!

The reason I bought up the subject (as mentioned above) with the Battery Specialist . . . they sell only batteries and high quality (read price!) at that, incidentally . . was because I'm apt to swop my batteries around between cars with Alternators and Generators/Dynamos. I actually wanted to buy a good old fashioned one. One that one could unscrew caps or prise up a lid, but I also wanted a built in lifting handle. The handle only came with the sealed for life type I was told!

Ahhhh ha, I thought, "I'll get into this so and so, so as to be able to check the cell's electrolyte levels, sometime in the future. This would be simply done by carefully easing off the sticker on the top to get at the one-piece cap. I'll do this as soon as I get home". It was not to be . . . what I considered as a "prise off cap thingy" was well glued down and although I gave it a good try, something would have broken if I'd persisted and applied a bit more force. Oh well . . . at least I have a handle to lift the beastly big battery out of the battery box!
Oh . . . and it does have a wee window in the top which reveals, by showing green, if the battery's charged . . . or black if it's not. Funny, and call me old fashioned if you will, but I can usually tell if the battery's charged or not without having to get out and open the bonnet . . . when it's in a car!

Regards, Leo.

[PaulB]

Well we have have started something, haven't we

I bought a new battery from Halfords this morning and fitted it into her. I am happy to say, that Jemmima is now tickety boo again

I've been out on the open road, and taken her for a 10 mile drive. Everything is OK and I'm looking forward to yet another season of Jowett motoring.

One curious thing though. The battery (HBO 038) says on the tin, maintenance free.

How can this be when there are a selection of screws on the top of the battery that cover the electro light's? and allow you to top up the levels as, and when needed.

[kemp1942]

Paul, this from a 'Swiftfit Battery Centre, Norwich', website:

'The two most common types of CAR batteries are low maintenance
(non-sealed) and maintenance free (non-sealed or sealed). [The low
maintenance batteries have a lead-antimony/calcium (dual alloy or hybrid)
plate formulation; whereas, the maintenance free batteries have a
lead-calcium/calcium formulation.]
The advantages of maintenance free batteries are less preventative maintenance, longer life, faster recharging, greater overcharge resistance, reduced terminal corrosion and longer shelf life, but are more prone to deep discharge (dead battery) failures due to increased shedding of active plate material.
In hot climates, buying non-sealed batteries is recommended because a sealed battery will NOT allow you to add water when required or to test the specific gravity with an external hydrometer. '

Last para obviously doesn't apply to us !!

Ian